Author Topic: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?  (Read 19198 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline bluegrassstate

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« on: February 12, 2010, 12:21:51 PM »
I have an opportunity to purchase a stainless Tanfoglio TZ-75 and had a few questions since not being familiar with them...Does the TZ-75 use the same magazine and grips as the CZ-75? Is the quality of the TZ-75 similar to the CZ-75? If so, would they be like comparing a Browning Hi Power to a F.E.G. Hi Power? any and all info will be greatly appreciated...thanks from the bluegrassstate..
p.s. reason for considering the TZ is that it's approximately $30.00 less than a similar CZ...does that make me a bad person..

Offline larryflew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1905
  • Minnesota
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2010, 12:31:49 PM »
IMO should typically be more than $30 difference but yes they are similar in quality etc.
, []]]]]]]]]]]\>
        )'_\   (
'            \ *\
'              \ _\


Larry

Minnesota shooter
and CZ fanatic
NRA life since the 70's
USAF 66-70

Offline bluegrassstate

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2010, 02:23:31 PM »
will they accept the same mags and grips???

Offline larryflew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1905
  • Minnesota
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2010, 03:50:37 PM »
That answer has to come from someone that has both. I have Witness in 45 so I can attest to the price differences and quality. In that case there is enough difference to the CZ 97 counterpart that the grips do not fit without significant modification.
, []]]]]]]]]]]\>
        )'_\   (
'            \ *\
'              \ _\


Larry

Minnesota shooter
and CZ fanatic
NRA life since the 70's
USAF 66-70

Offline Sheik Yerbouti

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 430
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2010, 12:40:26 AM »
You will have to try the magazines to find out.  My experience has been varied.  During the AWB, I was trying everything I could get my hands on for my pre-B CZ Compact.  Some mags would fit and some wouldn't and there was never any rhyme nor reason.  I finally figured out that for the most part, some judicious Dremel work on the mag catch hole in the magazine would enable me to use most of them, including mags for the TZ and P9.
_______________________________________
I have nothing interesting to put in my signature.

Offline jwc007

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7661
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2010, 01:24:14 AM »
That will depend upon which series of TZ75 and CZ75 you are discussing.

The Pre-Series 88 TZ75 (original series) were directly comparable to the original Pre-B CZ75.  So much so, that some parts and Magazines will interchange.  And yes, I have owned both at the same time.  Both have now been traded off.  The main differences at the time were Sights and Safeties.  The original TZ75 used a Slide Mounted Hammer Drop Safety, while the CZ75 has always used a Frame Mounted Safety. Very early TZ75's also had softer metallurgy.  Later ones were much better.  Notably the production just prior to the Series 88 pistols.

Series 88 TZ75's diverged dimensionally from the original TZ75 just as the CZ75B did from the Pre-B Series.  I've read here that Series 88 Tanfoglio Pistols can use CZ75B/85B magazines, but have no direct experience of this.  I do know that Series 88 Tanfoglio Pistols will use EAA Witness/Baby Eagle Magazines for the Series 88 and original Witness small frame.  Very few, if any, parts will interchange between the Series 88 and later Tanfoglio Pistols and the CZ75B.  EAA will have a stock of some parts for the early Tanfoglio Pistols.

Van is correct, as there were no Stainless TZ75's imported.  The Silvery looking ones had a very durable Industrial Hard Chromed Finish.  Tanfoglio did a small run of Stainless Pistols in the early Witness Series, but they are extremely rare.  If your TZ75 is actually Stainless, (doubtful), it may have been a transtional model to the Witness, making it even rarer still.

As for purchase, I do recommend the Series 88 Tanfoglio Pistols, provided they are in serviceable condition.  Inspect the barrel Chamber forcing area for wear, to see just how much the pistol has been fired.  If worn, definitely get the CZ75B.

If you are talking a Pre-Series 88 TZ75, that's more of a collectible, than a shooter. Buy the CZ75B instead, and don't look back!

« Last Edit: February 15, 2010, 01:36:22 AM by jwc007 »
"Easy is the path to wisdom for those not blinded by ego." - Yoda


For all of those killed by a 9mm: "Get up! You are not dead! You were shot with a useless cartridge!"

Offline bluegrassstate

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2010, 11:03:31 AM »
thanks to all that took the time to post a reply...I've decided to spend the difference and get a new or slightly used, if I can find one, stainless steel 75B or a variation thereof...once again thanks from the bluegrassstate..

Offline rmowrer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2012, 11:34:21 AM »
Just in case you haven't spent your money yet, I agree with jwc007, with a bit more clarification. 88 means 1988. The TZ-75 went through its major design modifications in 1988. Hence the pre '88 TZ-75 is equivalent to the "Pre-B CZ-75." I bought my TZ 75 in 1987, imported by FIE. Great gun.

Now the bad news. I just returned two Mec-Gar CZ-A1 magazines to Midway USA (very nice folks). They were listed as "ProMag Magazine CZ 75, TZ 75 . . ." So the TZ 75 they are referring to is most likely the POST 1988 model (CZ-75 B). The mags did not fit. I tapped a full one in the gun and couldn't get it out without a lot of work; the last inch wedged the magazine in tight. An empty mag got stuck at the same place. Also, once I started looking for the problem, I noticed that when I sat the two magazines on their butts side-by-side, the vertical angles of the mags were different (which makes me wonder about the grips), as was the mag release hole.

Bottom line - check the mfg. date of the TZ. If it's pre 1988, check the mags before you buy. jwc007 is right on the money.

Having said that, I'm looking for two (2) magazines for my pre '88 TZ 75. Any ideas as to a source, anyone?  Thanks.

Offline Midnight_Express

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 145
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #8 on: February 29, 2012, 02:20:58 AM »
Just in case you haven't spent your money yet, I agree with jwc007, with a bit more clarification. 88 means 1988. The TZ-75 went through its major design modifications in 1988. Hence the pre '88 TZ-75 is equivalent to the "Pre-B CZ-75." I bought my TZ 75 in 1987, imported by FIE. Great gun.

I have a TZ75 just a couple of years older than yours imported by FIE, the mags that work in mine are the Mec-Gar MG-21. I currently have four of these for my TZ, but it looks like Mec-Gar has stopped making them. My CZ75B magazines will also work in my TZ75, the MG-CZ75-9MM and the  MGCZ7519 have been fine.  Some have said the CZ mags don't work in the TZ75 but mine work great in both pistols.

Which brand did you return to Midway? You mentioned both Pro-Mag and Mec-Gar, but the part number appears to be a Pro-Mag.

Offline rmowrer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2012, 04:40:08 PM »
Thanks, Mid_Exp, for keeping this conversation alive. I, and others, who have pre-1988 TZ-75s may just find mags that fit yet!

I returned my Pro-Mags to Midway. They definitely did not fit. The Midway #111614. 15 rnds. They went in fine until the last inch, then it was like a wedge. Since I "tapped" them in, I had to pry them out

While at Midway, I looked up the Mec-Gar CZ 75 B (MGCZ7516B), 16 rnd. Midway states that "This magazine will not fit pre-B CZ 75 or 85 pistols. B suffix was added in 1988." So, my conclusion is that these will not fit my gun; they are for the CZ-75 B. However, you have CZ75B mags that fit. What gives? Watch this:

The Mec-Gar MGCZ7517AFC (17 rnds) description carried no such quote. The Midway # is 753049. Same thing with the MGCZ7519AFC (19 rnds), Midway #161853.

You're probably right about the MG-21 as regards availability. I would have to call Mec-Gar to see if they really have any. Nothing came up at either the Mec-Gar or Midway sites. I'll bet that's a 21-round mag?

You say, and I believe you, that CZ77B, MG-CZ75-9mm and MGCZ7519 mags work in your pre-1988 TZ-75. I can't tell how many rounds the first two hold (those are generic part numbers; no offense), but the third holds 19 rnds. Midway states that the Mec-Gar MGCZ7516B (16 rnds) won't work, and my returned  ProMags, which also hold 16 rounds, definitely didn't work.

So maybe the secret is that the higher round mags work, but the 16 round mags won't? How many rounds do your MG-21 and MG-CZ75-9mm hold? [Hopefully not 16; that'll kill my theory.] All I can tell from your post is that the 19rnd works for sure.

Unfortunately, there may be other variables in this; different design builds of the TZ-75 that may affect the fit of the magazine. Check out another string at this site:

http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=27574.0

OBTW, that's my gun in the pic at Tucson Dan's post. DABCZp07 "believes that mags from a full-size witness will work." ummmmmmmmmmmm.

FIE went out of business in 1990. I think I may have read that EAA picked it up.

So, my friend, the fate of this argument lays in your hands - if either of your two mags of unknown (to me) rounds hold 16, I'm stumped. If not, we might have help to offer everyone. Nonetheless, I might buy the 19 rnd mags. Sounds like I won't have to send those back.

"What a long, strange trip it's been." J. Garcia, et. al

Offline Midnight_Express

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 145
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2012, 03:29:09 AM »
From the description you gave on inserting the Pro-Mag, they sound like a pair of National magazines I bought for my TZ a few years ago. They were $11 a piece so I thought I would give them a try, they're now paper weights. The top of the mag would bind on the trigger bar as it traveled the last inch or so in, the top of the mag didn't have enough taper to clear.  After some pressing and filing to get them to insert and drop free they would not feed or cycle. Cheap spring, poorly molded follower and a rough surface inside.  So they became paper weights and dust collectors for a while.  I think I threw them away a few months ago, but I'll see if I can find them anyway.

Now, the magazine conundrum is about to get stranger. This may just add fuel to the fire instead of putting out the flames of "which bleep-in mag fits my gun".

All 10 of the magazines I have for the TZ75 and CZ75B combined fit and function in both guns. They all feed, drop free, lock in place, clear the trigger bar and lock the slide back. The only one that's different is the factory TZ mag, it will actually touch the CZ75B ejector if you hold the magazine flush from the bottom. But it just barely comes in contact with it, the mag clears the TZ75 ejector just fine. All the other mags clear the ejector in both gun.

I keep testing the mags in both guns thinking some age will start to show some problems, but haven't come across any yet.

Here's the list of what I have right here.

1 - Factory TZ, with the TZ75 when I bought it, holds 15 round, flat base plate and a matte blue finish.

4 - Mec-Gar MG-GT21, 16 round, flat base plate, polished blue finish. (these were bought in pairs about 3 years apart)

2 - Factory CZ, with the CZ75B when I bought it, 16 round, flat base plate, polished blue finish.

2 - Mec-Gar, "MG-CZ75-9MM" stamped on the side, 16 round, flat base plate, polished blue finish.

1 - Mec-Gar, # MGCZ7519 at Mec-Gar site, 19 round, Plus 2 plastic base pad and the new AFC finish. (looks matte black)

The 2 Mec-Gar mags for my CZ75B look just like the one below, product number 918412 at Midway USA.


The 4 Mec-Gar (MG-GT21) for the TZ75 still have the Assault Weapons Ban warning stamped on the front. "law enforcement, govt use and/or export only"  I was going to supply a link to them but couldn't find anybody that had them in stock. Checked with Mec-Gar and concluded they were probably discontinued when the part number didn't return any results.

The MG-CZ75-9MM is the actual number stamped on the two Mec-Gar CZ75B 16 rounds mags I have, but I don't think it's a part number. I thinks it's just a description of the weapon it fits. The Mec-Gar19 rounder has CZ-75-9mm stamped on it, again I think it's a description. The actual part numbers were on the packages and I tossed the packages long ago.

Here are some size comparisons, if you have a set of dial calipers it may help in finding some magazines.

Factory TZ75  - mag body 1.25 x .810 (measured in the center of the mag body, from front-to-back x left-to-right)
Factory CZ - 1.249 x .808
Mec-Gar for my TZ - 1.258 x .795
Mec-Gar 16-rd for CZ75B - 1.255 x .798
Mec-Gar 19rd for C75B - 1.255 x .802

Something I noticed at Mec-Gar is that they now have 17 round 9mm magazines for both the large frame and small frame witness. One is number MGWIT9SF, I'm assuming the SF indicates small frame. The other 17 round 9mm for a witness is MGWIT9LF, thinking the LF is large frame.

Another oddity from Mec-Gar, note the number on the magazine below, MG-GT21-16. Photo from Mec-Gars web site for part number MGCZ7516. Could just be the wrong photo though.


Offline rmowrer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2012, 05:20:12 PM »
M_E, the plot sickens. All the local gun dealer had in a cardboard box full of used magazines were 2 10-rnd "California" mags. They fit, but the plastic butt plates go up into the inside of the mag, and the sides of the mag have recesses stamped in, preventing no more than 10 rnds to be loaded. There are NO markings on the mags - I'd be embarrassed too, if I had to rework 16 rnd mags to hold only 10 rnds so you can only shoot at a CA bad guy 10 times before you have to put your own life in danger switching out mags.

Having said that, as soon as  I see if the 2 EA9M 16rds 9MM #101900 mags I ordered from EAA fit (I doubt it) I'm going to take your advice and try two Mec-Gar #918412 from Midway. It looks identical to the original mag in my TZ. Wish me luck.

Just received this email from Mec-Gar. Looks Like I missed it by a year. OBTW, the markings on my gun say it was made in 1986.

Thank you for your interest in Mec-Gar magazines.  All of our CZ75 magazines (16rd, 17rd and 19rd) are for the currently produced CZ75B series.  They do not fit in the original pre-B pistols.  MG-GT21 is a magazine for a steel frame original Tanfoglio Witness pistol.  Mec-Gar Italy discontinued this magazine last year for a new model using new tooling.  These magazines are made to the specifications of both CZ and Tanfoglio as we are an OEM supplier of these magazines to both companies.  All these magazines are double-stack.

Sincerely,

Mec-Gar USA, Inc.

« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 05:58:13 PM by rmowrer »

Offline mechanicalmike

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2012, 10:04:23 PM »
rmowrer -
I've got a 1985 TZ 75 and i was wondering if the two mags from midway (Mec-Gar #918412)worked for you or not?
I've only got one mag and was looking for a couple more - thanks.
mike

Offline RichieRich

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2013, 03:43:54 PM »
rmowrer,
Hi, just discovered this site, so apologize for being so late. I also have an older TZ75, probably mid 80's, not sure. Have tried to purchase mags in the past, but had the same problem as some others, the mags stick about 3/4 " from full insertion. I looked at the EAA 101900 mags, but not sure they will fit. Noticed that you said you had ordered some. Can you tell me if they worked in your gun? To all others, has anyone found that the Mec-Gar will fit? If so, which model or p/n, and where can I get them?

Have to admit I'm not an expert, but my gun seems well made, shoots great, and I love to take it to the range, but frustrated by only having one mag.

Thanks to all who can help.
Rich

Offline copterdrvr

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 197
Re: Is the Tanfoglio TZ-75, 9mm similar to the CZ-75?
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2013, 11:45:34 AM »
The MG  GT21-16 magazine fits all of my TZ 75-SERIES 88 pistols to include the Springfield P9 and Mossad varients.