22LR sub-sonic *not* recommended for 452/455?

[painter]

Lots of people play the Walmart in stock game. I don't have the patience.

I'd just as soon pay a couple of cents more, if it really ends up that much after all the running around and fuel costs, and have it delivered to my door.

[ocny17]

Lots of people play the Walmart in stock game. I don't have the patience.

I'd just as soon pay a couple of cents more, if it really ends up that much after all the running around and fuel costs, and have it delivered to my door.

True and makes sense.  Depends on one's area I suppose.  In my case, although I'm not lucky enough to have actual CZ firearms in my nearby local gun shops, I do have quick access to a few Walmart stores in all directions.

All non-local purchases in my area need to go to an FFL dealer (minimum $10 additional cost, typically $0.01/round fee). Factor in shipping costs and driving a little farther for the nearest FFL dealer, it ends up being about double or higher for me for 22LR when compared to Walmart.  Now, pistol ammo is a different story -- I buy almost exclusively these days from Freedom Munitions... until I find myself reloading like others.

[P.K.Hansen]

My cz455 shoots RWS subsonic just fine, but their Z-lang are all over the taget. A shame, because they are extremely quiet. Especially when using a silencer, they are perfect garden rounds.

[painter]

True and makes sense.  Depends on one's area I suppose.  In my case, although I'm not lucky enough to have actual CZ firearms in my nearby local gun shops, I do have quick access to a few Walmart stores in all directions.

All non-local purchases in my area need to go to an FFL dealer (minimum $10 additional cost, typically $0.01/round fee). Factor in shipping costs and driving a little farther for the nearest FFL dealer, it ends up being about double or higher for me for 22LR when compared to Walmart.  Now, pistol ammo is a different story -- I buy almost exclusively these days from Freedom Munitions... until I find myself reloading like others.

That's unfortunate. We don't have those restrictions here, which is a good thing because I haven't seen a box of 22 in any Walmart for over 2 years and online or LGS is the only option. The LGS has silly limits of 1 or 2 boxes which won't get me through 2 bullseye matches in the winter indoor league I shoot.

Availability seems to be improving everywhere. Too bad prices will stay significantly higher than they were before this shortage.

[ocny17]

Prices are definitely at an all-time high.  'Wish they'll come down a bit once there's a surplus (yeah, sure, I'll hold my breath).

I took the 455 Training rifle to the indoor range today (was raining) which only gave me upto 20 yds shooting distance.  Well, my eyes could see clearly up to 15 yds and in a standing position, I was able to group about 1/2" using all 3 ammo (Winchester M-22 @1255 fps, Federal AutoMatch @1200 fps, and CCI Quiet @710 fps).  At 20 yds, lighting was poor and my eyes couldn't see clearly anymore, so I didn't have good groupings.  I'll see if I can get to an outdoor range next time as I'd like to test accuracy at 50 yds for all 3 ammo types.

Oh, the CCI Quiet ammo was... no surprise, VERY quiet.  I had a split-second doubt if I fired the gun or if the guy a few lanes away was the one who fired.  No issues whatsoever with the CCI Quiet.

[painter]

How was the POI of the quiets compared to the other ammo you shot?

[Ruber]

I've not tried the quiets or cb's much beyond 25 yards.  In my experience, at that range, poi was close to that of SV rounds when using factory sights.  For precise shooting at that range, adjustments would need to be made between the different types, but I saw no variation that wasn't typical of brand to brand variation in SV, though I don't know if I'd call the CCI quiets precise.

A lot will depend on your sight system (open vs globe vs scope) as that effects distance from line of sight to the bore axis.  Using factory irons sighted at 50 yards with SV ammo, I'm happy with throwing in the quiets and firing away in the 20-60 yard range at the rimfire silhouette sized targets.


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[ocny17]

How was the POI of the quiets compared to the other ammo you shot?

Using all 3 ammo, I was hitting center of bullseye @ 15 yds which is the limit of my vision for my small targets in our so-so indoor range.  At 20 yds, I couldn't really see my targets that sharply anymore, grouping wasn't good, but all 3 ammo types were still centered around bullseye.  I was expecting the CCI Quiet to drop a little bit, but I suppose 20 yds isn't far enough for this to be noticeable.

'Hoping to get to an outdoor range next time and shoot from a bench.

[painter]

All good info. Thanks.

Under the circumstances I'd use a quiet round it sound like the POA/POI is close enough to SV that I don't have to re-zero..

[Ruber]

Ehhh... Within their useful range.  Don't run out and try a 100 yrd match with them.

The Remington quiets had better bullet design at the same velocity as the cci's.  Made them a tad noisier, but they held their path better and actually shot better than most 22 shorts I've tried (and quieter).

Ps.  This is what I use for squirrels to rats out at about 25-50 yards with the Rem quiets.  I'll use the CCI quiets more in the scout at 25 or less where having the sights close to the bore really helps.  I use a BL-22 a lot also, but if it's muddy out, I use the CZ's...

[Flytyer]

Thread is perhaps a bit old, but still relevant.
I have tested the CCI Super Quiet in both types, the segmented hollow point and the Lead Round Nose. In my 455 Trainer I get about 1 out of 5 rounds of the segmented hollow points stuck in the barrel. They usually fall out on their own after about 20 seconds but they don't exit the barrel when fired. I rarely get a LRN subsonic to fail to exit, but it has happened a couple times. Both are rated at 710 fps muzzle velocity and 40 grains. Trajectory falls off fast after 20 yards, so I only use them for close in shooting.

[carrollms]

I just visited the CZ FAQ, and there is a  sentence at the end that I did not see posted above - possibly added: "This is not to exclude quality match or target ammos, which may remain sub-sonic in speed."

here is the Q&A in context at as of 1/13/18 http://cz-usa.com/support/faq/

quote

Q: ?I?ve heard you use tight bores in your .22s, is that right? What does that mean??
A: Our 22 LRs use our cold hammer forged and lapped barrels, and are built a bit tighter than many other guns. In 22 LR we run a .211 bore, which is one of the reasons our .22s are known for incredible accuracy. This also means that a .17 or .20 rod and jag are required for cleaning, since a .22 rod will be too large.

Additionally, use of .22 Short, Long and ?Sub-Sonic? ammunition isn?t recommended because of the tight bore. This is not to exclude quality match or target ammos, which may remain sub-sonic in speed.

end quote

Comment: I just bought two bricks of CCI SV 50 gr to use in my new CZ455 before coming across this discussion. I suspect there will be no issue with its use, but I will be mindful of the answer and qualifier given above and all positive comments in the string concerning CCI SV.

msc

 

[painter]

You'll have no issues with the CCI SV.

[Catdaddy2]

I don't  know about presently but before cci quiets had a disclaimer on the box not to shoot out of barrel longer than 24".

[painter]

I don't  know about presently but before cci quiets had a disclaimer on the box not to shoot out of barrel longer than 24".

I've seen photos of that warning, but also don't know if they're still currently using it.

Quiets, and Colibri's, are the specific types of ammo that the recommendation was addressing.