Author Topic: Baldrage's reloading log  (Read 8452 times)

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Offline Boris_LA

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #30 on: September 26, 2016, 02:19:02 PM »
I have Hornady LnL AP and while new it had the same behavior. Jumps/stops on next station abruptly and shake may cause the spilled powder from the case. On LnL it fixed by tuning the RAM height and tweaking the detent balls under the shell plates. I am sure some similar tuning technique exist on the Dillon press. Search YouTube for Dillon tuning videos.

Offline nicky

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #31 on: September 26, 2016, 07:17:13 PM »
I don't know if the SDB is anything like the 550. If it is you might try loosening the center bolt of the plate a little bit. That might help to keep your powder from spilling out when indexing.

Offline Dan_69GTX

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #32 on: September 26, 2016, 09:00:04 PM »
I don't have your press. I got the Hornaday. However, when researching presses I did read in many locations that Dillon has excellent support. Give them a call.  And of course, let us know what you find out.
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Offline Wobbly

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #33 on: September 26, 2016, 09:29:03 PM »
I filled up the powder hopper with HP-38, and practiced filling an empty casing, weighing the powder charges, and adjusting the powder setting.  Zeroed the scale with a check weight before starting.... 


That's the RCBS 505 scale ? What check weight ?

...and it was accurate to hundredths of a grain. 


Unless you used a 5gr check weight you can't make that statement. You must use a check weight in the weight region that you intend to weigh. Since W231 is usually loaded at ~4.3gr, you'll need to be zeroing with 5gr.

4.3gr of W231 shouldn't be high enough to jump out of the cases.

 ;)
« Last Edit: September 27, 2016, 08:18:59 AM by Wobbly »
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Offline baldrage

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #34 on: September 27, 2016, 08:08:31 AM »
I don't know if the SDB is anything like the 550. If it is you might try loosening the center bolt of the plate a little bit. That might help to keep your powder from spilling out when indexing.

Thanks, that sounds like a great suggestion.  I did take out the center bolt to remove the shellplate when doing my initial cleaning, and it is certainly possible I over-tightened when putting it back on.  I will give that a try before dialing Dillon!

Offline baldrage

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #35 on: September 27, 2016, 08:19:00 AM »
Wobbly sir, thank you for the feedback!

What scale ? What check weight ?

As stated in my lengthy first post, I am using an RCBS 5-0-5 beam scale, not one of those new-fangled electronic gizmo-thajingies.  :D

I have a set of gram checkweights, and the smallest, 2 gram checkweight is equal to 30.8647 grains, according to the conversion calculators I see on the intrawebs.  When weighing the 2 gram checkweight on my RCBS, the scale came out to just a hair above zero when set at 30.8, and just a hair below zero when set 30.9.  So, I concluded that it is accurate to within a few hundredths of a grain, although perhaps it would be more technically correct to say it is accurate to a tenth of a grain.

4.3gr of W231 shouldn't be high enough to jump out of the cases.


I was using 4.0 gr as a charge just for weighing purposes and to test out dialing in the powder measure and its ability to throw consistent amounts of powder.  Yes, 4.0 gr only filled the case to ~3/5 to ~2/3 full using a rough eye-ball test, so you are correct, it was not near the top of the case or spilling over.  However, the "hiccup" in the rotation of the shellplate was violent enough to cause some powder to pop out of the top of the case and spill onto the shellplate.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2016, 12:15:57 PM by baldrage »

Offline Wobbly

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #36 on: September 27, 2016, 08:23:09 AM »
As stated in my lengthy first post, I am using an RCBS 5-0-5 beam scale, not one of those new-fangled electronic gizmo-thajingies.  :D


I had forgotten you mentioned the scale way back in the beginning and went and checked it. Yes, my fear was you were using a cheap electronic rip-offs. It's all good.
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Offline baldrage

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #37 on: October 01, 2016, 03:27:51 PM »
Still having issues with the hard indexing of the shellplating causing powder to bounce out of empty case ... tried loosening the shellplate, it seems to help for five or six cases, then right back to "snapping" into place on station #3 and bouncing powder out all over the shellplate.  Removed and cleaned the shellplate, re-greased the underside of the top of the shellplate bolt, but it made no difference.  I'm stuck on this problem until I have time to call Dillon, but in the meantime, I guess I can just put a fingertip over the case when advancing from station #2 to #3 to keep powder from flying everywhere ...

I decided to make up some dummy cartridges (no powder, no primers) to test out OACL and crimp measurements.  I used my 124 gr RMR FMJ RN bullets, thinking FMJ bullets would be easier to start with then plated or lead bullets.  Using the plunk test with the barrel of my SP01 Shadow, I determined OACL was 1.140 (cartridge "tinged" when dropped, fit flush, rotated freely, and fell out under its own weight when barrel was turned upside down).  Subtracting .015 margin gives me a target OACL of 1.125... sound correct?

Using 1.125 OACL and 0.378 crimp measurements as targets, I adjusted the dies and tested until I was getting right on or very close to the desired measurements, then went ahead and made up 5 dummy rounds, operating the SDB as a turret press, one round at a time.  I then measured all 5 dummy rounds, pulled the bullets, and used the same cases and bullets to make another 5 dummy rounds.  Results as follows:

#1 - 1.126 OACL, .3755 crimp
#2 - 1.1275 OACL, .378 crimp
#3 - 1.129 OACL, .376 crimp
#4 - 1.1265 OACL, .376 crimp
#5 - 1.130 OACL, .378 crimp

#6 - 1.130 OACL, .376 crimp
#7 - 1.130 OACL, .3785 crimp
#8 - 1.1265 OACL, .378 crimp
#9 - 1.125 OACL, .377 crimp
#10 - 1.1285 OACL, .376 crimp

So, biggest deviation from target measurements was 0.005, average OACL was 1.1279, or ~0.003.  All 10 dummy cartridges passed the plunk test.  Is this "close enough," or should I adjust the dies some more?

Offline nicky

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #38 on: October 01, 2016, 07:15:16 PM »
I personally won't except that more variation in OAL. That's just me. Someone with more knowledge than me can tell you how safe it would be. My guess is you would be fine as long as you are not up at a max load.

As far as spilling powder,if it anything like the550 there is a hex screw bellow the shell plate the has to be tightened after you adjust the center bolt.

Hope this helps.

Offline Wobbly

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #39 on: October 01, 2016, 10:27:15 PM »
The OAL for all nubies varies quite a lot. It's not the machine, it's your arm. It's not until you've loaded about 2000 rounds that things start to calm down and the repeat-ability sets in. You'll get there.

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Offline baldrage

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #40 on: October 03, 2016, 08:34:46 AM »
The OAL for all nubies varies quite a lot. It's not the machine, it's your arm. It's not until you've loaded about 2000 rounds that things start to calm down and the repeat-ability sets in. You'll get there.

Thanks for the feedback, Mr. Wobbly.  I had seen you make similar comment to many other newbs before, that is why I was thinking dies are dialed in "close enough" for now.  No point chasing .003 inches in die measurement, when operator error is resulting in >.003 variance ...

Offline IDescribe

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #41 on: October 03, 2016, 12:24:34 PM »
Any tips on how to smooth out the rotation of the shellplate so that powder does not go flying out of the casing after it is filled?

I have a Dillon 650.  There is a shell plate detent under station 4.  It's a large, heavy polished steel ball bearing on top of a stiff spring.  When the shell plate finishes indexing, and the ball-bearing "pops" into place in its cavity on the underside of the shell plate, powder jumps out of the case. Every time.  It's not anywhere  near the half grain you're estimating with yours, but it is a known condition with the Dillon 650.  With the 650, for those wishing to address the problem, the steel ball-bearing can be replaced with a lighter plastic one.

I have never used a Square deal and have no idea if the above describes your problem.  Since a Dillon 550 is manually indexed, there's no reason to have that strong of a detent, and I doubt you'd see the issue with that press, but the Square Deal's detent might be a little overbuilt for its job, like the 650's.  You are describing it as a lack of smoothness or a hitch in the rotation, but I would ask that you look at it closely and/or verify -- is this definitely happening during the rotation?  Or is it happening at the end of the rotation, when it comes to a stop and the detent clicks into place.  If it happens to the same degree regardless of how fast the shell plate is moving, it seems unlikely the problematic action is with the shell plate itself.  It seems like it has to be something else striking the shell plate or otherwise striking some part of the press and transferring energy through the shell plate into the case.

I can watch the powder in my cases jump.  It's easy to see.  So the first thing I would do in troubleshooting this is to watch closely, and make sure I know at exactly what point in the indexing the powder jump is occurring.  If it's happening at the very end, it's the detent.  If not, my next step would be to run the press with no cases and keep my finger pressed lightly against the top of the shell plate over the spot where the powder jumps, letting the shell plate slide under my fingertip. If it's something striking the shellplate or press at that exact moment, you should be able to feel it, and if you can feel it, you might be able to coordinate that with the sound of the strike.  Knowing the exact moment in the index that it happens and what it sounds like should you begin hunting this thing down. 

Just make sure to rule out the detent first.  ;)

Offline Augie.Cooper

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #42 on: October 04, 2016, 01:03:20 PM »
You mentioned that you are buying Federal Small pistol primers, since you are successfully shooting factory ammo you don't need to pay that premium when any primer would do the same job cheaper.

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Offline Wobbly

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #43 on: October 04, 2016, 08:57:39 PM »
You mentioned that you are buying Federal Small pistol primers, since you are successfully shooting factory ammo you don't need to pay that premium when any primer would do the same job cheaper.


Federal primers are no more expensive than Winchester, Remington, or CCI. Places like Bullets.Com put them on sale all the time.

 ;)
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Offline baldrage

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Re: Baldrage's reloading log
« Reply #44 on: October 05, 2016, 08:32:43 AM »
I have never used a Square deal and have no idea if the above describes your problem.  Since a Dillon 550 is manually indexed, there's no reason to have that strong of a detent, and I doubt you'd see the issue with that press, but the Square Deal's detent might be a little overbuilt for its job, like the 650's.  You are describing it as a lack of smoothness or a hitch in the rotation, but I would ask that you look at it closely and/or verify -- is this definitely happening during the rotation?  Or is it happening at the end of the rotation, when it comes to a stop and the detent clicks into place. 

Thanks for the lengthy comment and advice! 

It is definitely happening at the end of the shell plate rotation -- the shell plate is "snapping" into place when it enters each station.  Otherwise, the shell plate rotation is pretty smooth.

Based on your comments, and some other research I have done, that leads me to believe it is the detent ball popping up and hitting the shellplate.  I have seen others recommend replacing the detent ball as you suggest, and/or clipping half a coil off of the detent spring that sits under the ball. 

Since I am still a newb and learning the ins and outs of operating the press, getting a smooth stroke down, etc. I am hesitant to start clipping parts! I will, however, look into whether the plastic bearing sold for the 650 would work on the SDB.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2016, 08:37:21 AM by baldrage »

 

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