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Author Topic: Not happy  (Read 5312 times)

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Offline Hyunchback

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Not happy
« on: May 29, 2006, 09:01:47 PM »
I picked up my TZ 75 88 Series from the gun smith. I'd asked to have the extractor spring replaced. He had it for a good, long time.

I'd taken it there after multiple failures to extract dependably.

It happened with all FMJ ammunition I tried.

Symptoms: Stovepiping is the worst symptom since that leads to a failure to fire. The other symptom is found most often on a EAA 10 round magazine. The last round fired will extract then lay on top of the magazine. It may be that if it wasn't the last round then a stovepipe would result.

What's next? I doubt that it's my gunsmith's fault. I didn't say "fix it" I said "replace such and such part".

Replace the recoil spring? Try out different magazines?

I think the guy who sold it to me had purchased 2 CZ 75 magazines (15 round) out of the 3 he passed along with the sale. They don't drop out of the TZ but when I slid them into my recently aquired SP 01 they went in fine and dropped free with just a push of the magazine release. I haven't tried firing them in the SP01 yet.
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Walt-Sherrill

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« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2006, 04:12:24 AM »
TAKE THE GUN BACK TO HIM AND TELL HIM HE DIDN'T FIX IT!  You paid him to fix it, and he didn't.  Let him worry about it.

Could be a bad extractor, which he should have seen.  A rough chamber, which he should have seen, or a weak extractor spring -- which you can only find by firing the gun.

Tell him about the Wolff extra-strenght extractor springs used with CZs...

Its unlikely that the mags are related to the extraction problem.
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Offline Hyunchback

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« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2006, 06:00:49 AM »
I'd only brought up the mags as I have exactly 1 magazine with the orange EAA follower and I recall seeing the cartridge laying on THAT follower. It's color makes it stand out.

This Sunday, the first shooting trip I'd had since picking up my TZ from the gun smith, I loaded that magazine along with another 10 rounder with a black follower (base is marked on the black one Tanfoglio) and one of the 15 rounders I suspect is really a CZ.

I had 1 stovepipe and when I went to extract the EAA magazine the empty cartridge case fell out. It had once more been sitting on top of that magazine.

I can't remember for sure which magazine was in when I got the stovepipe.

I love how the TZ feels in my hand. That's why I now troll for CZs on every forum that has classifieds. I've considered other EAAs or Baby Eagles but have been really reluctant to spring for them if I can get a CZ.

I will contact my gunsmith and see what he says.
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Seismic-Sam

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« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2006, 01:52:35 PM »
If you had bought an EAA and sent it back, you'd still be waiting, the gun STILL wouldn't be fixed, but you would have had the pleasure of Paul the Pissy gunsmith telling you it was all your fault because you weren't shooting factory ammo!! (non factory ammo includes Corbon, Doubletap, and about a dozen others...)   >:
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Offline SLM crew chief

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« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2006, 03:04:32 PM »
Failure to extract is why my EAA Witness stays home most of the time.  The only ammo that I've found will work 100% of the time is Blazer aluminum cased.
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Walt-Sherrill

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« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2006, 03:56:48 PM »
Interesting.  All of the EAA I've had worked just fine.  Including several "conversion" slides.
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Offline Rod Slinger

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« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2006, 08:08:49 PM »
I agree with you Walt,  my EAA's are the most reliable gun I own.
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"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.  Thomas Jefferson

Offline Hyunchback

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Not happy
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2006, 08:13:42 PM »
The TZ is back with my gunsmith. They had test-fired it, according to their records, but they don't state how many rounds they put through it.

The shop person I talked to today seems to be leaning toward wear on the extractor, given the symptoms. They have some way to test fire in house so they can test it out to see if they have it fixed.

It's now not "replace this part" it's "diagnose and repair".

We shall see.
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Offline jwc007

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« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2006, 05:12:24 AM »
The extractor and extractor spring are among some of the easiest parts to replace and/or fix on these pistols.  Also examine the magazine feed lips for smoothness and quite possibly the magazine springs.

My comparable Series 88 TA90's are among the most accurate handguns in my inventory and very reliable, so this is not the norm.
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"Easy is the path to wisdom for those not blinded by ego." - Yoda


For all of those killed by a 9mm: "Get up! You are not dead! You were shot with a useless cartridge!"

Offline Hyunchback

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« Reply #9 on: May 31, 2006, 05:54:34 AM »
Thanks for your input.
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Offline ReloaderFred

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« Reply #10 on: May 31, 2006, 09:34:15 AM »
The extractor and/or spring sound like the culprit.  I took my Series 88 out yesterday and the day before and put about 400 rounds through it without a hitch.  

It sounds like the angle of the extractor hook may be off, probably through wear, if the gun has been shot a lot.  Sometimes you can reshape it, if it's not too bad, but I would just replace it, along with the extractor spring.  As JWC007 says, it's a really easy fix.

Hope this helps.

Fred
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After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it. - William S. Burroughs

Offline Hyunchback

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« Reply #11 on: May 31, 2006, 06:49:54 PM »
I would have considered doing such a job until I read a line in a gun magazine. "We gunsmiths love you do-it-yourself types".

Add to that ominous sounding phrase that the gunsmith shop is owned by a member of my gun club so I'm keeping business 'in the family'.

He is also an FFL and will do transfers for only $25 when I used to spring for 35 a pop and I suddenly don't mind taking the gun back a second time.

I do believe this gun saw a lot of use before I ever go it. The tech I talked to discussed possibly re-shaping the extractor. If that isn't working then replacing it is also a probability.

With the extractor spring already replaced for a new standard one then the extractor's shape/wear is the likely issue. If it's worn down then it doesn't matter how strong the spring is, it will tend to lose grip on the rim.
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Offline jwc007

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« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2006, 09:04:40 PM »
Quote
Quote:
"We gunsmiths love you do-it-yourself types".


And I'm sure some gunsmiths love that phrase as well.  Ka-Ching! :eek

If you are not mechanicly inclined, then it is best to hire things done.

Quote
Quote:
A Man has got to know his limitations!
Clint Eastwood as Dirty Harry Callahan, 1971


However, I think that most people are more mechanicly inclined than they know or give themselves credit for.

I do a lot of my own work that involves simple tools (perhaps some not so simple) and Dremeling.  When I need Machine Shop work, Welding, or something needing special tooling to be done, then I hire it done.

For your extractor work all you need are the parts, the right sized roll pin punch, and a dummy/slave pin made from a nail that as about the same size or slightly smaller than the hole for the Extractor Retention Roll Pin.  It's a 5 minute job, tops!
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"Easy is the path to wisdom for those not blinded by ego." - Yoda


For all of those killed by a 9mm: "Get up! You are not dead! You were shot with a useless cartridge!"

Offline Hyunchback

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« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2006, 09:16:35 PM »
That's what I thought when I took my Beretta NEOS apart to clean it and lost a tiny little spring!

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Offline jwc007

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« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2006, 09:43:45 PM »
OK, then perhaps YOU should hire this work done!

However, a Tanfoglio TZ75/88 is a far cry from a Beretta Neos.
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"Easy is the path to wisdom for those not blinded by ego." - Yoda


For all of those killed by a 9mm: "Get up! You are not dead! You were shot with a useless cartridge!"
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