Author Topic: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever  (Read 730 times)

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Offline Earl Keese

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2017, 10:45:46 AM »
I think I may switch to this since this will allow me to seat and crimp on separate steps without losing a station.

Time to revisit my setup!


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I moved things around a couple times before I settled on my current set up. I also like the added safety of not having a full powder drop on the press while seating primers.

Offline Boris_LA

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2017, 11:09:39 AM »
I think I may switch to this since this will allow me to seat and crimp on separate steps without losing a station.

Time to revisit my setup!


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I use separate seat and crimp dies for match rounds setup. For practice rounds, i use bullet feeding and seat/crimp dies combo instead. Having flexibility of extra station is great.

Offline SlvrDragon50

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2017, 11:33:07 AM »
I think I may switch to this since this will allow me to seat and crimp on separate steps without losing a station.

Time to revisit my setup!


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I use separate seat and crimp dies for match rounds setup. For practice rounds, i use bullet feeding and seat/crimp dies combo instead. Having flexibility of extra station is great.

Unfortunately I messed up my bullet feed die and polished too much so that it works for 115gr but not 147gr! I didn't think it mattered that much! I also didn't try with the full weight stack either. Oh well.

I do need to call Hornady and see if something is wrong with mine though since it seems to stutter.

Are you just using your combo die as a seater for your match rounds or did you buy a separate seating die?

Offline Boris_LA

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2017, 01:32:46 PM »
I have few dies from HDY and Lee bough as sets or separate dies.
For match rounds with JHP I use separate seating die in station 4 and crimp die in station 5. Very small adjustment between 125gr HDY HAP (.356") and PD 124gr JHP (.355") bullets and sorted brass. This is for high demand 50m precision ammo for BE matches.
For practice FMJ rounds I use bullet feeding die in station 4 and HDY bullet seating/crimping die in station 5. Only use one size bullet PD 124gr FMJ (.355") or HDY 124gr FMJ RN (.355"). Crimp adjusted on the seating die and don't require changes. Allows for little faster production with acceptable results even for mixed brass within 25m.
All dies are already pre-adjusted and locked in the bushings with HDY lock rings. Changing dies produce repeatable results that only need verification before every batch.
I use yet another full set of the dies (mixed Lee and HDY) on my Lee Classic Turret Press that used for load development, small test batches or in single stage mode for de-capping/resizing.
Having extra pre-configured dies for specific tasks saves setup time, frustration and worth it for me.

Offline tdogg

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2017, 02:16:24 PM »
I use both on my LNL and if an empty or double gets to the station it does lock up the press from moving forward.  I cannot fully pull the lever/cycle the press.

Are you using the correct powder insert (white plastic foot)?  Is it adjusted such that as the case mouth enters the die the (touches the case lock) that white line is showing (with the appropriate amount of powder in case)?  RCBS states to have the die about 1/4 inch off the shell plate when fully raised.  I'm not sure where I setup my die?  I'd imagine the lower the die body the sooner you would get lock up in the event of a powder issue.

I don't rely solely on the lock out die, I just use it as a backup in the event I get distracted and don't look into the case when placing the bullet.  It works as advertised for me as I sometimes forget to adjust it when doing caliber changes and it lets me know I forgot.

Cheers,
Toby


Offline SlvrDragon50

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2017, 04:05:26 PM »
Mine will not prevent the shell plate from cycling forward because it cycles very early with the half steps. I have my die body adjusted as Boris_LA does in his picture. It does lock the press as I don't believe any powder will drop on the previous station, but the issue is with the 1" distance, I don't notice it with my forceful sizing hand movement.

I asked over on BE, and it seems like 1" lock is the norm.

Offline Wobbly

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2017, 08:35:41 AM »
For match rounds with JHP I use separate seating die in station 4 and crimp die in station 5. Very small adjustment between 125gr HDY HAP (.356") and PD 124gr JHP (.355") bullets and sorted brass. This is for high demand 50m precision ammo for BE matches.

For practice FMJ rounds I use bullet feeding die in station 4 and HDY bullet seating/crimping die in station 5. Only use one size bullet PD 124gr FMJ (.355") or HDY 124gr FMJ RN (.355").

Must be fairly exacting requirements to force 2 different setups for nearly identical ammo. That's not a critique, simply an observation on the level of precision your using. I'm still trying to wrap my mind fully around what you're saying here.

It would be easier on my old brain if I could simply stop gawking at the photos of your very impressive reloading setup.

Wowser ! ;)
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Offline Boris_LA

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2017, 02:27:17 PM »
Wobbly,
I may not fully understand how to explain it clearer. JHP use different OAL from FMJ and dies preset for that OAL. Swapping dies on LnL is easier than chasing OAL when starting each batch. Extra $20 for die cost worth it for me.
I can't afford alibis while shooting BE match and match rounds loading process finished with separate crimp operation (FCD). The belling actually (mostly) removed with seating die already , but FCD is just for extra insurance that finished round conforms the dimensions. I also gauge them with SB 100 hole gauge. Before I've employed this process, I actually had occasional ammo related alibis that cost me points in the match. Now its eliminated. Confidence in your equipment and ammo just as important for precision match as shooting technique. Its all mental state. I need very repeatable results otherwise I will be chasing my red dot setting for a good portion of the match. I don't have luxury of verifying sight setting before each match.

FMJ for practice is less demanding. No extra insurance needed and if I have once in a while FTF round its not a big deal, although I haven't had it yet. If crimp is slightly off due a mixed brass and slightly opens group its not critical for the shorter distance. Thus free up station on the press allow for extra die and I choose bullet feeding die.

Two similar setups is not forced, but rather elected. LnL bushing system allow pre-configured die change very easy and quick. No tweaking needed. That differentiate it from some other presses where die change is more expensive and more involved process, therefore many prefer simply adjust already installed die for different bullet.

I use similar two dies setup for 45ACP. One die for JHP and another for LSWC. Both preset for corresponding OAL. The same separate taper crimping die works for both bullets. I load then now on Lee Classic Turret press 4 hole. No feeding die.

Would more pictures of dies setup help? I know everyone here love "gawking" at pictures. Without them its all boring reading.

Offline Wobbly

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2017, 05:21:49 PM »
Would more pictures of dies setup help?


No I got it now, and for the price you're right, it makes perfect sense. Your Hollow Point is the HAP, which is conical nose versus the PD which is a plain RN.

So do you seat the HAP with a flat anvil to get perfect OAL, seat it with a tubular anvil to control your concentricity, or have you made a special anvil just for the HAP ?
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
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Offline SlvrDragon50

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2017, 07:16:37 PM »
Wait. Should I have bought the Lee FCD? I bought the Lee Taper Crimp Die since people were saying the FCD is for other purposes.

Offline Boris_LA

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2017, 07:25:30 PM »
My hollow points for 9mm are both HDY HAP (.356") and Precision Delta JHP (.355"). They are so close in dimensions and behavior, so I use them interchangeably with minor crimp adjusting if needed for specific brass. Same depth and powder charge.
My FMJ RN are also both from HDY and Precision Delta. They are also nearly identical and loaded to exactly the same depth and powder charge. I don't adjust seating/crimping die when changing FMJ RN bullets and accept minor OAL difference between them. When I finish my stash of HDY FMJ RN from Cabela's sale, I will just stay with PD for practice ammo.
My indoor range requires FMJ and don't want to see JHP, otherwise I would use PD JHP only.
All bullets are seated with hollow anvils and since sorted brass is used, the consistency with JHP bullets are staying within 0.001"-0.002". With FMJ RN bullets 0.002"-0.004" and crimp varies a little if mixed brass used. If once in a while I have practice round with lager OAL deviation (0.005"-0.007") I don't sweat it and just shot it in practice. The load is nowhere near max and I feel safe.
Should we move this discussion to different thread? I feel that we are steering it off the original topic.

Offline Boris_LA

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #26 on: August 31, 2017, 07:30:05 PM »
Wait. Should I have bought the Lee FCD? I bought the Lee Taper Crimp Die since people were saying the FCD is for other purposes.
FCD is an extra insurance and may catch the problem that should not be in on the first place, but might slip in.
Depending on your requirements and process you may not need it at all. Taper crimp is also not strictly needed with modern dies that already include this option, but it make it simpler to adjust if separated from seating.

Offline SlvrDragon50

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #27 on: August 31, 2017, 07:58:45 PM »
I have a taper crimp seater die that has already been set up for 147gr FP, but it was an absolute pain to setup. Also, I think I have my bullets overcrimped which is why I can't pull my bullets.

Offline Boris_LA

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #28 on: August 31, 2017, 08:04:10 PM »
Crimp is not difficult to setup. Start with no crimp and then add little by little until its where you want it. Back off if too much crimp. Thats why separate crimp is recommended. It doesn't affect the seating operation. Taper crimp should work for you.

Offline SlvrDragon50

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Re: RCBS Lockout Die and Hornady ERGO Lever
« Reply #29 on: August 31, 2017, 08:26:16 PM »
Crimp is not difficult to setup. Start with no crimp and then add little by little until its where you want it. Back off if too much crimp. Thats why separate crimp is recommended. It doesn't affect the seating operation. Taper crimp should work for you.

Ahh, cool thanks! I think I will eventually upgrade to a micrometer seating die. In the meantime, the Hornady taper crimp seater will work as my seater! Almost running out of the bullets SPO1Shadow sent me, but I think I'm gonna end up getting ACME 147grs.

I tried out my chrono today and found out I'm shooting 120 PF so I have to up my load a bit :P I knew the load was too light.