Author Topic: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?  (Read 17521 times)

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Offline Lawikfors

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #120 on: January 10, 2018, 08:22:25 AM »
Notching the underside of the decocker lever where the decocker spring touches sounds like a workable idea . I was thinking of putting a heavier spring under the ejector to make it harder to push down

Offline Lawikfors

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #121 on: January 11, 2018, 05:20:00 PM »
In my opinion, the problem needs to be addressed with where the problem starts . The ejector and ejector spring! the ejector should not be moving downward while the gun is being fired no matter what the circumstances. That way the fix will solve both issues with the safety or the decocker being able to fall or walk out. I know the ejector has a spring that keeps upwards pressure on it which is holding either the safety or decocker there and I know that it is used to make it easier for the user to switch between the two. In my mind it either needs a stiffer harder to push down ejector spring or a removable pin that doesn't allow the ejector to move downwards at all.

Offline M1A4ME

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #122 on: January 11, 2018, 06:37:40 PM »
I keep reading on this thread but it's getting pretty long now and hard for me to keep track of.

Mine is both older and an Urban Gray model and I use the safeties.

Is it still a true statement that only the pistols made in 2017 using the decocking levers are having this issue?

If that is true, I have a question.  Doesn't the pistol use the same ejector and spring whether it's running the decocking levers or the safeties?

More questions - has anyone measure the widths of the slots in the decocking levers and the safeties to see if there is a difference.  If both (safety and decocker) are allowing the ejector to move fully up into the slot, then what is different between the use of the decocker or the safety?

I'm not having the issue (with the safeties) but I'm still really curious about the true cause of this problem.  Heck, some day I may pick up a 2017 P01 at a gun show (same reason I read about 1911 issues although mine are perfectly reliable - some day, who knows).

I keep coming back to there being something wrong with the fit between the decocking lever (left side) and the ejector as being the problem.  Some out of spec. parts.  Or, in spec. but each of the two parts (decocking lever and ejector so close to the edge of the spec. that if two "barely in spec" parts end up in the same pistol you have a problem.
Better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it.  So, if you see me walking the dogs with my SIG 556R, its okay.

Offline supergunner84

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #123 on: January 12, 2018, 08:39:39 AM »
I keep reading on this thread but it's getting pretty long now and hard for me to keep track of.

Mine is both older and an Urban Gray model and I use the safeties.

Is it still a true statement that only the pistols made in 2017 using the decocking levers are having this issue?

If that is true, I have a question.  Doesn't the pistol use the same ejector and spring whether it's running the decocking levers or the safeties?

More questions - has anyone measure the widths of the slots in the decocking levers and the safeties to see if there is a difference.  If both (safety and decocker) are allowing the ejector to move fully up into the slot, then what is different between the use of the decocker or the safety?

I'm not having the issue (with the safeties) but I'm still really curious about the true cause of this problem.  Heck, some day I may pick up a 2017 P01 at a gun show (same reason I read about 1911 issues although mine are perfectly reliable - some day, who knows).

I keep coming back to there being something wrong with the fit between the decocking lever (left side) and the ejector as being the problem.  Some out of spec. parts.  Or, in spec. but each of the two parts (decocking lever and ejector so close to the edge of the spec. that if two "barely in spec" parts end up in the same pistol you have a problem.
M1A4ME,
So far in this thread, only people with 2017 production have experienced the issue.

The ejector spring is the same, the only items that get swapped when running safties is the decocker spring, the lever and the right side lever. I do not know if the springs in earlier models were stiffer, if so, that could play a part.

The ejector slot on the levers for the safties and decocker on mine allow for the ejector to fully seat. The widths are the same.

In my opinion, it is the fitment between the left hand side lever and the right hand side lever. Coupled with the decocker spring putting a side load on the left hand side lever, all that has to happen is something pressing on the ejector downwards and the game is up.

I would suspect that those that has the lever walk out during normal operation (no FTE) have something that is holding the ejector down. There may be a burr on either the ejector or lever that is preventing full engagement.

CZ really needs to investigate this and give a solution.

Cheers,
SG

Offline M1A4ME

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #124 on: January 12, 2018, 09:27:27 AM »
SG, thanks for the update/info.

It just hit me, reading your post that another issue could be a slight change in the location of the cut in the left side lever.  If that were part of the issue then it would act like an incorrect width of the ejector or the cut in the shaft as the ejector could not fully move into place in the cut on the decocker shaft.

Yeah, I agree, CZ needs to stop hiding behind the desk, sit up straight and do the right thing, whether it's a recall to study the problem and fix it, or just replace all the defective pistols with correctly made pistols.

I mean, if it's only the 2017 made pistols then something changed at CZ and they really should be able to figure out what it is and fix it.

It would sure upset me if mine were failing.  It's one of the things I brag about with my CZ's - reliability (and accuracy).  One, without the other, isn't why I buy/carry/shoot CZ pistols.
Better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it.  So, if you see me walking the dogs with my SIG 556R, its okay.

Offline Lawikfors

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #125 on: January 12, 2018, 12:49:10 PM »
I keep reading on this thread but it's getting pretty long now and hard for me to keep track of.

Mine is both older and an Urban Gray model and I use the safeties.

Is it still a true statement that only the pistols made in 2017 using the decocking levers are having this issue?

If that is true, I have a question.  Doesn't the pistol use the same ejector and spring whether it's running the decocking levers or the safeties?

More questions - has anyone measure the widths of the slots in the decocking levers and the safeties to see if there is a difference.  If both (safety and decocker) are allowing the ejector to move fully up into the slot, then what is different between the use of the decocker or the safety?

I'm not having the issue (with the safeties) but I'm still really curious about the true cause of this problem.  Heck, some day I may pick up a 2017 P01 at a gun show (same reason I read about 1911 issues although mine are perfectly reliable - some day, who knows).

I keep coming back to there being something wrong with the fit between the decocking lever (left side) and the ejector as being the problem.  Some out of spec. parts.  Or, in spec. but each of the two parts (decocking lever and ejector so close to the edge of the spec. that if two "barely in spec" parts end up in the same pistol you have a problem.
M1A4ME,
So far in this thread, only people with 2017 production have experienced the issue.

The ejector spring is the same, the only items that get swapped when running safties is the decocker spring, the lever and the right side lever. I do not know if the springs in earlier models were stiffer, if so, that could play a part.

The ejector slot on the levers for the safties and decocker on mine allow for the ejector to fully seat. The widths are the same.

In my opinion, it is the fitment between the left hand side lever and the right hand side lever. Coupled with the decocker spring putting a side load on the left hand side lever, all that has to happen is something pressing on the ejector downwards and the game is up.

I would suspect that those that has the lever walk out during normal operation (no FTE) have something that is holding the ejector down. There may be a burr on either the ejector or lever that is preventing full engagement.

CZ really needs to investigate this and give a solution.

Cheers,
SG
If I hadn't of sent my gun in I could measure how deep the notch was where the ejector pushes into the decocke.  That could very well be the problem. considering mine was happening during regular fire and not during malfunctions it would change the angle at which the brass hits it as well.

Offline Justcuz

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #126 on: January 14, 2018, 03:23:26 PM »
Hey SG 84, I was finally able to take my P-01 Omega, (bought Nov.2017, sent back to CZ and recieved back in early Dec 2017) to the range twice in the pass 2 weeks and put over 300 rounds without any decoking lever issues.  I thought they had NOT fixed it, but turns out I can't make it come out like I was able to before I sent it to CZ.  However now while shooting I've experienced a loaded chamber followed by a "dry fire" and then I have to pull back the hammer and pull the trigger again which made it fire after the 2nd trigger pull.  This has happened at least 5 times out of 200+ rounds fired last week.  I ejected the round everytime and there was a stricker mark on the primer.  Each round fired while struck a second time.  It only occured during my first shot out of 100 rounds yesterday.  I'm going to continue placing more rounds down range and see if the problem can work itself out.  I also wanted to use this gun for my CCW, but so far I have ZERO confidence with the current Omega system.

Offline supergunner84

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #127 on: January 14, 2018, 07:55:46 PM »
Hey SG 84, I was finally able to take my P-01 Omega, (bought Nov.2017, sent back to CZ and recieved back in early Dec 2017) to the range twice in the pass 2 weeks and put over 300 rounds without any decoking lever issues.  I thought they had NOT fixed it, but turns out I can't make it come out like I was able to before I sent it to CZ.  However now while shooting I've experienced a loaded chamber followed by a "dry fire" and then I have to pull back the hammer and pull the trigger again which made it fire after the 2nd trigger pull.  This has happened at least 5 times out of 200+ rounds fired last week.  I ejected the round everytime and there was a stricker mark on the primer.  Each round fired while struck a second time.  It only occured during my first shot out of 100 rounds yesterday.  I'm going to continue placing more rounds down range and see if the problem can work itself out.  I also wanted to use this gun for my CCW, but so far I have ZERO confidence with the current Omega system.

Glad CZ got your firearm working correctly, I would be interested to see if you swapped out the decocker for the safety configuration if it would fall apart like mine:
Reference:

Regarding the FTF, that's no fun. What type of ammo are you using? I haven't heard of CZ's being particularly picky regarding ammo, but you may have a box of some really hard primers.  Is the ammo feed in other firearms you own?

If you feel up to it, you may want to take out the firing pin and make sure there isn't any odd wear marks on it where it could be catching of the firing pin block.

Lastly, there is a roller on the firing pin block lifter assembly that may be forcing the trigger bar to not allow the block to fully lift.  If you keep having issues, send it back to CZ again.

Cheers,
SG

Offline rkubatk21

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #128 on: January 14, 2018, 10:46:28 PM »
Sorry to hear that.  Not being able to hold/shoot a new one is always painful/aggravating.
I just hope its fixed correctly, I really do like it.

Have you heard back from CZ yet, just curious what they replaced, if anything.

Cheers,
SG





Jan 5th I emailed them and they said my gun is first in line and I still dont have my gun back yet.....its been two months im really starting to lose my patience.

Offline rkubatk21

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #129 on: January 14, 2018, 10:50:19 PM »
How many folks have actually experienced this failure at the range?  Not too many I suspect.  If you are concerned, just do the dimple fix.  It's simple.  My omega has been perfect but when I could make the safety lever fall off by tipping the gun with the slide back and the ejector lifted up, I dimpled the safety lever before I reinstalled it.  It can't fall off anymore.
I have, not ideal to have happen in a life and death situation. I should not have to alter my gun to prevent it from having a mechanical failure.

Offline supergunner84

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #130 on: January 14, 2018, 11:04:05 PM »
How many folks have actually experienced this failure at the range?  Not too many I suspect.  If you are concerned, just do the dimple fix.  It's simple.  My omega has been perfect but when I could make the safety lever fall off by tipping the gun with the slide back and the ejector lifted up, I dimpled the safety lever before I reinstalled it.  It can't fall off anymore.
I have, not ideal to have happen in a life and death situation. I should not have to alter my gun to prevent it from having a mechanical failure.
Completely agree. I have several others for carry and this is now just a dedicated range item. Have you talked with them to get a refund due to defective hardware?

SG

Offline rkubatk21

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #131 on: January 14, 2018, 11:06:09 PM »
How many folks have actually experienced this failure at the range?  Not too many I suspect.  If you are concerned, just do the dimple fix.  It's simple.  My omega has been perfect but when I could make the safety lever fall off by tipping the gun with the slide back and the ejector lifted up, I dimpled the safety lever before I reinstalled it.  It can't fall off anymore.
I have, not ideal to have happen in a life and death situation. I should not have to alter my gun to prevent it from having a mechanical failure.
Completely agree. I have several others for carry and this is now just a dedicated range item. Have you talked with them to get a refund due to defective hardware?

SG

No I haven't I plan to do that this week.

Offline rkubatk21

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #132 on: January 15, 2018, 10:49:45 AM »
Just got off the phone with them, they had my gun the second time for 37 days. Two gun smiths checked it this time and it should be working correctly, it is a design flaw and the warranty guy told me its out of his hands if CZ wants to do a recall or not. I should have my gun back in the next few days. So we will see if its truly fixed.

Offline rkubatk21

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #133 on: January 15, 2018, 12:15:05 PM »
"Description: 2nd time in

Work Performed: Replaced Decocker spring. Installed Customers CZ sights at customers request, waived fee for installing sights due to gun coming back numerous times. Test fire good with 60 rounds, no malfunctions or issues with decocker.

Once your firearm has shipped, you will receive an additional email with tracking information from FedEx within 24hrs.

 

Best Regards,

CZ-USA"


SG as you mentioned earlier, should they have done something with the lever as well?

Online mig1nc

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Re: P-01 Omega Safety Concern?
« Reply #134 on: January 15, 2018, 07:30:41 PM »
How do you tell if an Omega gun is a 2017 dom?

No, that's not a joke, serious question.

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