Author Topic: .40 Questrions  (Read 462 times)

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Offline kerncat

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.40 Questrions
« on: December 30, 2017, 07:08:26 AM »
Got some terrific answeres to my questions about using range pick up brass...about bulge bustig....about cartridge head support in a .40 CZ, etd....now I feel very comfortable to proceed with at least a bit of a proper procedure and what to look out for.....been loading a long time but just never have messed wit .40 or wit h 9mm...didn't really seem cost effective for my shooting...but now with some of the California Follies being brought i nto play by our gubberment and with the potental for more laws I have stockpiled a bunch of stuff including bringing myself up to speed on a couple calibers I shoot but have not loaded for.  So now bring em on.

One area (and I'm no surprised as everyone has a favorite) is in the selection of a bullet...my intent is to get as close to the profile of the factory bullet in a copper plated or lead with hi tek coating....And now we get into the brand discussion.  Lots of folks making bullets and the coatings are all pretty similar so now to the "reviews"

I began with Berry's Bullets as It's been around  long time....threw that name out...the Missouri Bullet which with their coated bullet has been my go to revolver bullet in coated lead for everything I load in handguns...Threw out some model numbers, etc...got replies wit other company names (many new to me) and some I'd had bad experiences through change of ownership, etc, etc.

Guess I'm at that point of trying to narrow down bullets for thefirst couple of hundred rounds...my leaning is toward Berrys in just their run of the mill bullets...then would come Missouri bullet's 155 grain coated bullet.....and then perhaps "explore" some of the lead bullets with no grooves on it all.

Everything will be in the 155-165 range for now and my loadings will be moderate....I want the bullet pattern to sort of mimic a factory bulllet (Truncated Cone flat point) for my initial go arounds...Powder?  I have 231 and 38 (same), Universal,Unique, Bullseye and a couple of others can't recall this early in the morning.

Just thought I'd throw out the "components" mix I'm looking at to get any comments....while I can probably go and buy more powder brands I'm pretty sure I can find good loads with what I have so prefer not to run off into othter powders for nowl...got plenty of nice prepared brass and both CCI and Winchester primers....

Happy new year to everyone....we stay off the roads...many years ago when I did imbibe some we called New Years Eave "Amature " night and a good time to stay off the roadsl

Offline Wobbly

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2017, 08:27:24 AM »
What happened to the 40 questions ? I only see 1 or 2 !  O0


155-165gr seems to be the sweet spot for the 40. Pretty much follow the same rules as with a 9mm bullet selection... Rounded ogive is going to have zero feed issues. Not too big on the flat front, whether its a RNFP or a JHP. You can probably get excellent jacketed at about the same price as really good plated.

 ;)
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
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Offline kerncat

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2017, 09:31:42 AM »
Howdy sir...long time no talk...guess I was looking for some actual case history stories on what has been tried pretty much in my parameters and with what luck?..I know that there are lead bullets (coated) and some are grooveless and some are grooved..I'm sure there is some performance difference in the  two and that kind of thing...I'm going to put together a pretty specific work book of notes on the different loads as I develop them..don'e that for every load I've ever worked  up....but with the new pc coated there are hundreds of styles and designs the way I see it and if for some reason a particular type bullet or the factor of groovless or grooved come into play...I'd hope some folks might save me a few bucks in buying test packages .

That kind of stuff...

Thanks

Offline tdogg

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2017, 10:38:36 AM »
My first loads in 40 were with power pistol and xtreme 165 rnfp plated bullets.  Shot well but were kinda pricey.

I've had great luck shooting coated lead out of my 45 and 9mm.  I haven't picked any up in 40 yet.

Lately I've been shooting pulled down plated bullets from American reloading.  If you are patient they go on sale and you can get them for less than 7 cents per bullet.  I usually get them in either 165 or 180 both in rnfp profile.  They do come with collet puller marks but it doesn't seem to impact accuracy.

In my rig the 180gr option shoots better in the velocity range I load for.  I mainly am concerned with making power factor and cost.  Accuracy is good but that may be a result of shooting these or of the tactical sport Orange which makes me look way better than I actually shoot.

Cheers,
Toby

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Offline dave33

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2017, 12:00:08 PM »
If your press has the ability to seat and crimp in two different steps coated lead is a good choice.  If you are going to seat and crimp in one step I would go jacketed or plated.  If you go with a jacketed or non oversized plated bullet I would also recommend using a U die as a little extra insurance against bullet setback.

Lots of good coated lead options out there, pick a color and profile you like and have at it.  If you go jacketed, precision delta is a great option if you order at least 2k at a time, good discount and free shipping.  Berrys makes a good plated bullet, I personally use a lot of Xtreme plated bullets as they are good quality and if you catch the sales make them close to coated lead in cost.  As of this week Xtreme is 15% off and free shipping, I think that ends today.  I run their heavy plated RN bullets in my 9mm open gun at major power factor and they do great, very consistent and accurate.

Offline levellinebrad

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2017, 04:36:35 AM »
I have shot some 165gr  precision deltas and I really like them. They are a bit snappy as compared with the 180 gr Blue Bullets that I normally shoot. I know a lot of the guys are shooting 190 and 200gr in competition. They are extremely soft shooting. As far as making a round that mimics a factory round, you will need to chrono your factory rounds and then try to get your loads to the same velocity.
Greed and the struggle for power will rule the day until we the people decide we have had enough.

Offline IDescribe

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #6 on: December 31, 2017, 12:29:55 PM »
I want the bullet pattern to sort of mimic a factory bulllet (Truncated Cone flat point) for my initial go arounds...

Kerncat, this is one of those common perspectives that I don't quite get.  First, WHAT factory bullet?  There are a plethora of factory bullets.  Second, in one way or another, every motivation for handloading is to shoot a non-factory load.  So unless there's is a specific factory cartridge you want to duplicate for a very specific reason, trying to duplicate some abstract vision of a general "factory load" doesn't make a whole lot of sense.  ;)

But probably most importantly, it would seem the process is kind of backwards.

For ANY load development, it's best we determine what we want to use the round for first.  Then let THAT determine everything that follows.  Self-defense load?  Self-defense practice load?  Plinking?  Accuracy at 25 yards?  At 50 yards?  130PF .40 minor loads?  170PF .40 Major loads?

What will the round be used for?  What bullet best serves that need and at what velocity?  What powder best meets that velocity requirement while fulfilling other considerations, such as recoil impulse, flash, cleanliness, etc.. 

That's my two cents.  Give it some thought.  ;)

Offline kerncat

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #7 on: December 31, 2017, 01:45:06 PM »
My reference to "factory bullet" refers to the more common truncated flat nose bullet found in much of the "plinking" .40 ammo...none exactly the same probably but much is similar....There are hundreds of bullet styles..no question...different weights, different ogive characteristics, different uses, different materials, etc....

I went through a big dog and pony show about 8 or 9 years ago with the original style model 97..I decided I wanted to use the Hornady self defense bullet and began to look it over and discuss it with some folks...The way the older CZ was built made it pretty picky on bullet shape, size, style, etc..My intention to follow " a factory style" with the .40 is because I've purposly avoided the .40 for reloading (for over 40 years) as I don't like high pressure loads in handguns..my feelings were that the more common style of plinking bullet for the .40 would give me a bit more comfort in getting acquainted with the round as I began loading it....being 80 I'm perhaps a bit more cautious than some....the "end use" for what I load these days is nothing more than punching paper..older, a bit infirm and not hunting nor using the new .40 for self defense would indicate my "selection" for what I intend to use the bullet for...the question is answered...some may think that just loading to shoot is a backwards goal...I've done plenty of load development and experimenting...but today I just enjoy the fun of shooting my own ammo...and I've got friends that load and it's a place where I can meet with guys in my age range and just chat...we've all already "proved our stuff" over many years so now it's just part of a much bigger picture.

It's like when we began to load wildcat rifle rounds in the late 50's and early 60's..things like the Ackley improved's, the 25-06's, the 30 Gibbs...there was hardly anything to go by and we went ahead any way...our testing was to tie the rifle to a spare tire and yank a cord to fire the rifle from a distance away..if it survived...we felt we had a shootable load...These days, even with the huge amount of data..I still move very cautiously...I'm sure you would wonder about my reluctance to shoot the .40 in 200 grain loads or even down  to the 180's...my comfort level right now would be with the 155-165 grain bullet in a style that I'm pretty sure will load in the 75B chamber and feed with the stock CZ magazines...I'll bet there are some of the high end self protection rounds that simply won't fed or work well..but I'd rather not be experimenting right now....I like to load for the loading itself...it's a place where I can focus, be in a quiet area and the output of ammo is a bonus when I shoot it and it works well....I no longer hunt...I don't do any more precision long range shooting...I just enjoy the hobby....I don't even care if it costs more than buying factory ammo....I just like it...that's my 2 cents worth...Happy New Year...
« Last Edit: December 31, 2017, 01:59:58 PM by kerncat »

Offline IDescribe

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #8 on: December 31, 2017, 02:39:42 PM »
I'm sure you would wonder about my reluctance to shoot the .40 in 200 grain loads or even down  to the 180's...

Not so much.  I'm the guy who said I'd go with the coated 165gr ACME and BBI.  ;)  I'm also one of the guys who recommends against people automatically going after the heavy-for-caliber bullets for the supposed recoil advantages.  So, yeah, 155-165 is great.  Was just trying to provide some direction for bullet selection. 

For me personally, in the past when I've said "These seem like good/interesting bullets -- I think I will buy some," I typically end up with boxes of bullets that I never load.  ;)   



Happy New Year...

To you, too, sir.  ;)

Offline kerncat

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #9 on: December 31, 2017, 03:00:46 PM »
I'm sure you would wonder about my reluctance to shoot the .40 in 200 grain loads or even down  to the 180's...

Not so much.  I'm the guy who said I'd go with the coated 165gr ACME and BBI.  ;)  I'm also one of the guys who recommends against people automatically going after the heavy-for-caliber bullets for the supposed recoil advantages.  So, yeah, 155-165 is great.  Was just trying to provide some direction for bullet selection. 

For me personally, in the past when I've said "These seem like good/interesting bullets -- I think I will buy some," I typically end up with boxes of bullets that I never load.  ;)   



Happy New Year...

To you, too, sir.  ;)


I got a whole garage full of "special things" I thought would be just the ticket...and they are just filling space...I spent a lifetime collecting and restoring antique gasoline and steam engines (from toys up to some larger variety...do you have any idea how little interst there is these days for a genuine John Deere Medel E gasoline engine?  so there it sits with all it's brothers and sisters...taking up space...next to the cabinets full of toy steam engines...just had to have them and they were "perfect" for the time...oh well.

Offline Wobbly

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #10 on: December 31, 2017, 03:48:56 PM »
...do you have any idea how little interest there is these days for a genuine John Deere Model E gasoline engine?  So there it sits with all it's brothers and sisters... taking up space...


Could I interest you in another one ?    ;D
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline kerncat

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2017, 06:27:12 PM »
NO!!

Offline Wobbly

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2018, 09:24:36 AM »
My intention to follow "a factory style" with the .40 is because I've purposely avoided the .40 for reloading (for over 40 years) as I don't like high pressure loads in handguns...

The S&W40 has only been with us for 28 years. So 12 of those years it was fairly easy to avoid.  ;D
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline kerncat

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2018, 05:19:07 PM »
My intention to follow "a factory style" with the .40 is because I've purposely avoided the .40 for reloading (for over 40 years) as I don't like high pressure loads in handguns...

The S&W40 has only been with us for 28 years. So 12 of those years it was fairly easy to avoid.  ;D

You are picking on me....at my age it's amazing I can still spell .40

Offline baldrage

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Re: .40 Questrions
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2018, 04:12:40 PM »
So Kerncat, it's been a couple of weeks ... what bullet did you end up going with and what were your results?  I'm planning on getting into reloading for .40 this year, too, so curious about where you ended up, especially WRT 165 vs. 180 gr bullets.

 

anything