Author Topic: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...  (Read 561 times)

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Offline Mifune326

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Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« on: February 11, 2018, 09:34:14 AM »
I recently picked up a P-09 and P-07.  LOVE them both!  My only complaint would be that the DA is a little too heavy on both.  The SA I can live with.  The pistols are going to be used as self-defense tools so I don’t want to do any radical modifications to either.  I just want to throw in some CGW springs to lighten the DA a little.  Recommendations?

Offline schnee72

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2018, 09:43:30 AM »
I too am a new P-07 owner. I had the same thoughts about how heavy the DA was. I relieved some of the pressure off the trigger bar spring and it made a huge difference. This thread has a good explanation:

https://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=66147.0

I was able to do it without actually taking anything apart. I moved the spring out of it's position and I was able to bend it down a little without much effort. The DA felt so much better after this easy mod. I later added a full CGW Pro kit to my pistol, which elevated it way beyond my expectations, but that one simple mod of reliving some of the pressure on that spring was mandatory in my opinion.

Offline Smitty79

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2018, 10:18:22 AM »
I put a CGW trigger return spring, main spring and extended firing pin spring in my P07.   Couple thousand rounds since then.  Lighter DA pull.  TRS is more reliable than stock.   Very little SA pull difference.  The last is thought to be important in after shooting legal problems.
Don't mistake my high post count for knowledge or wisdom.   I just like hearing myself type.

Offline Mifune326

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2018, 11:27:22 AM »
Thank you for the suggestions!  That’s exactly what I was looking for.  I don’t want to modify anything too radically on a self defense pistol.  Just wanted a little reduction in the DA pull!

Offline briang2ad

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2018, 03:57:34 PM »
1) To lighten it a little:

Do the trigger bar spring mod (a couple of minuted max).  This can smooth things a bunch in a gun that is not stacking.
Dry fire the snot out of it
Shoot several hundred rounds through it - this will smooth it, making it feel lighter.

2) A bit further and requires disassembly:

Polish the trigger bar and roller
replace the TRS with a CGW one

3) Still a bit more:

Cajun extended FP, FP Spring, and FPB spring
15 and 18 LB hammer spring
(And at this point you MIGHT want to go for the short reset kit and roller)
Might then try the CGW sear spring (can make the SA a little more crisp especially given the hammer spring decrease.

This plan is incremental and improves the trigger in steps.

Note, if you are like me, my roller (disconnector part) is too small for a replacement, and must be polished.

My advise for folks is to buy retail sight seen and get a gun that does NOT stack - it will be gritty and maybe stiff, but if it doesn't stack it can be made into a very good trigger.

The truth is that the DA pull is NOT the strong point of the P series guns.  I tried more different P guns at the show yesterday and none had a decent DA trigger OTB.  All need work - not a preference for good shooting - a need.   The one I got has potential, and does not stack - that's a start.

The strong point of the gun is reliability, accuracy,  durability, and shootability (even with a mediocre trigger, these things aim/hit naturally.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2018, 07:25:55 PM by briang2ad »

Offline DOC 1500

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2018, 07:31:16 PM »
This was given to me by Sonspark, said I could pass it along....
Ok - here is the rundown... just as an FYI, this is generally geared around the P-07/P09 series but the general idea applies to almost every CZ - the specific part options may just differ :)

As discussed in the thread, the two weak points, historically, with CZs has been the trigger return spring, the firing pin retaining pin and the slide stop. Generally, if something has broken on a stock gun it is one of those parts (and, of course, the slide stop usually only fails after suffering a ton of rounds through the gun...)

I would replace the retaining pin and the trigger return spring with the ones from Cajun Gun Works at a minimum. It has been suggested that CZ went through a period where the TRS materials they sourced were somehow out of spec and that is what caused the unexpected breakages. Many folks don't bother replacing the stock part  - they just make sure they keep a spare or 2 handy. I prefer to play it safer... the CGW parts are better parts to begin with. The slide stop is usually only a concern as your round count rises but, again, I choose to keep a spare on hand to minimize down time if one breaks.

As for the other upgrades, for the P-07/P-09 series they improve either the double action or single action trigger press.

Out of the box I find the DA press rather heavy on most CZs and sometimes it is not very smooth - the Omega triggers do seem better in this regard, but the issues are still there. To address them you would do the following things:

1) Replace the stock 20# hammer spring (HS) with an 18# (defensive use) or a 15# (competition/range use) CGW spring- this lowers the DA pull weight. Actually, using the CGW TRS reduces the DA weight by about 1/2# too. You would opt for the 15# HS only for competition use, really, because it limits your ammo choices and generally is better suited to those who reload and can choose softer primers.

2) Replacing the HS requires you to, at least, replace the FP spring as well because a lighter hammer spring reduces the amount of force the hammer strikes the FP with and, if you pair that with the stock FP spring, you run the risk of light strikes.

3) I also replace the stock FP with the CGW extended FP in my defensive guns, just to make sure the gun goes bang when it should. This is not strictly necessary, though, for range use.

4) Another small upgrade that helps to smooth out the DA press is the firing pin block plunger spring - this is a reduced power spring that does not affect function but reduces the feel of disabling the block during the trigger press.

5) The final component of the DA upgrade parts is the roller - the stock roller sometimes results in a less than smooth trigger press and timing issues. The CGW part addresses all of this.

The SA out of the box is not as crisp as it could be and there is a bit of creep there usually. The reset is also not as short as it could be. To address that you would do the following:

1) Replace the hammer. The CGW hammer (or the CZ Custom hammer) changes the geometry and allows for a super crisp break with no creep and very little, if any, overtravel.

2) Replace the trigger. CGW makes an trigger with an adjustable overtravel screw - this will allow you to totally eliminate any overtravel.

3) install the CGW short reset kit. This actually includes the FP and FP spring as well as a better quality lifter and disconnector. The lifter and disconnector and tuned to reduce the reset point by 40-50%.

4) if you find that the SA trigger is lighter than yu would like after these upgrades you can swap in a heavier sear spring - there are basically 2 heavier options, depending on how much heavier you want to go.

Upgrades for other CZs follow similar a path - there are a few more options available there, though - more hammer spring weights, etc... There is also a reach reduction kit available for those guns that can help if you find the DA trigger position to be too far out there. Another option is CZ Custom's flat trigger - it has a cool shape and, again, reduces the trigger reach. Sadly my fingers are too long to even consider that.

I know this is a lot to take in... don't let it overwhelm you :) A lot of it comes down to how you intend to use the gun. Just know you have options to tune it as much as you may want.

Anyway, hope this helps... feel free to hit me up with questions anytime!

Cheers
JOHN 3:16
2 COR.5:17
A Lie is a Lie even if everybody believes it ,
The Truth is the Truth even if nobody believes it !!!

Offline Mjolnir

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2018, 08:02:43 PM »
Awesome content, brothers!

Loving this place more and more.


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Offline ranastas

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2018, 08:15:25 PM »
If I may offer the abridged version get the full kit from CGW read the upgrade thread on here watch a video or 2 that joe mustang made. And bam the gun will be in my humble opinion one of the best defensive weapons around.


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Offline Mifune326

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2018, 09:36:02 PM »
Always fantastic info shared here.  That's why it's the best forum on the planet.  As always, thank you to all for sharing that info freely.

Chris

Offline briang2ad

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2018, 05:18:09 PM »
Always fantastic info shared here.  That's why it's the best forum on the planet.  As always, thank you to all for sharing that info freely.

Chris

BTW:  I’m Eyore here on P07 DA triggers, and my first P07 that was a HORRBLE STACKER now has a light sweet da pull and is 100% with Tula 9mm.  Took a trip to KC then some Cajun spice, and plenty of dry firing, polishing, and several hundred rounds.

Offline Winkel

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2018, 08:29:01 PM »
Like others have said here, if you're on a budget, the best recommendation I can make in addition to the trigger bar spring and the requisite polishing, would be the extended firing pin and lighter hammer spring. 

Like I said, if you're on a budget, try this first and see how you like it.  I did this on my P-09 and it made a noticeable difference.

All of the other Cajun goodies would be great as well but this is a good place to start.

Offline briang2ad

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2018, 06:59:57 AM »
Like others have said here, if you're on a budget
That is why I made my post incremental, and targeted.

Not everyone wants to take their $450 gun (a major sales point from ALL the reviewers bar none), and turn it into a $670 gun or even an $750 gun.  I've even seen a review where the guy has likely $1200 in his P07 and goes on about how inexpensive it is to buy.  And... even CGW, when advising me before I purchased only recommended the SR kit and some mainsprings. 

Offline DOC 1500

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2018, 09:04:09 AM »
For me, P-09 $419...CGW SPRINGS $45...
videos and my time sanding, stoning,polishing.
Result: DA 6.8# SA 2.8#  .
Don't need to spend a lot of money.
Do your research buy a couple of Springs do some sanding and polishing.
..woo hoo👍
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 09:16:52 AM by DOC 1500 »
JOHN 3:16
2 COR.5:17
A Lie is a Lie even if everybody believes it ,
The Truth is the Truth even if nobody believes it !!!

Offline briang2ad

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2018, 12:41:58 PM »
DOC:  you’re right on about the money.

Is that a carry gun?  Can you light hard primers?  What mainspring are you using?
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 12:52:38 PM by briang2ad »

Offline DOC 1500

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Re: Want to lighten the DA on my P-07 and P-09 a little...
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2018, 06:23:09 PM »
Rp trs , rp block spring, rp fps, 15# hammer spring.
It fires everything I put into it.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 06:24:45 PM by DOC 1500 »
JOHN 3:16
2 COR.5:17
A Lie is a Lie even if everybody believes it ,
The Truth is the Truth even if nobody believes it !!!

 

anything