Author Topic: 125 gr SWC not plunking  (Read 1082 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Wobbly

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8422
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #30 on: May 24, 2018, 09:36:05 AM »
So maybe sanding 0.001 or 0.002" off the bullet before seating would help you there.


I'm going to assume that was a joke.  ;)


No sir, I'm serious. With plated and jacketed, we always know we're in the 0.355/0.356" dia range. So it's simply not a concern.

But with lead, we could be anywhere from 0.355 up to 0.358" dia according to multiple variables associated with casting, sizing, AND coating. So anytime we deal with lead bullets of any description, we need to take them on a case-by-case basis.

What I'm simply pointing out is that a 0.357/0.358" dia bullet may need some help fitting into the 0.356" freebore of a CZ chamber smoothly enough to get a good read on Max OAL using our finger push method. (Lead is soft enough that the pistol's slide can easily bulldoze any excess out of the way during shooting.) That's why I specifically exclude lead bullets in the instructions for the finger push method. Not all lead bullets are created equal.


However, I will concede that case length also figures into Max OAL. I cover that in the 0.015" setback. That dimension sounds rather generous until you start thinking about variations in case length, variations in production OAL, and bullet variations.

 ;)
« Last Edit: May 24, 2018, 09:38:39 AM by Wobbly »
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline M1A4ME

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3464
  • I've shot the rest, I now own the best - CZ
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #31 on: May 24, 2018, 11:18:19 AM »
Regardless of as cast/sized diameter - what is the chance that a soft bullet might "swell" some when being seated into a tight case mouth?  What's in the case can't swell, but the further down the case the bullet travels the more resistance increases.  Has anyone ever seen/measure the diameter of the bullet, right above the case mouth after the bullet is seated/case mouth crimped?  Just so see if the bullet deformed where it isn't supported by the case?
Better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it.  So, if you see me walking the dogs with my SIG 556R, its okay.

Offline IDescribe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3672
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #32 on: May 24, 2018, 03:00:01 PM »

No sir, I'm serious.



My mistake!   ;D  You were talking about push testing for max OAL.  I thought you were recommending it as a standard practice for production.  ;D

Offline Wobbly

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8422
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #33 on: May 25, 2018, 09:22:56 AM »
Nettle -

Apologies for the derailment of your thread. Back to your concerns and issues. Are you making progress ?
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline Wobbly

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8422
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #34 on: May 25, 2018, 12:19:11 PM »
As reloaders we work and converse in terms of "OAL", but where the meplat of the bullet falls is of ZERO consequence ! What you need to control with a SWC is how far the bullet's shoulder protrudes into the chamber.

Hope this helps.  ;)

New graphics to illustrate these concepts....



Since it's the SWC's shoulder location that controls the ability of the cartridge to enter the chamber, the best way is for the anvil or "seating stem" to push on the shoulder of the SWC and thereby control THAT dimension. In other words, allow the meplat (and consequently the OAL) to end up where it may. When using SWC bullets, it's the shoulder location that really counts in order to gain consistent feeding.

Such a seating stem is shown in red in the cartoon below...



See that the shoulder is used for seating, and the conical section is used to center and straighten the bullet during the seating process. I hope these ideas get some brain cells percolating !


Hope this helps.  ;)

PS. Such an anvil is also the best way to seat bullets like the PD 124gr JHP and the Hornady XTP/HAP... you simply don't have a shoulder to push on, so the conical portion is doing all the work.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 12:28:21 PM by Wobbly »
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline schmeky

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2741
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #35 on: May 26, 2018, 09:51:47 AM »
Wobbly,

I really enjoy your posts on reloading.  It is quite obvious to me you are accomplished and have the knack for providing excellent illustrations for new and aspiring reloaders.

I think you should be promoted to "Captain of the CZ Forum for Reloading".

You would certainly have my vote.

Offline Wobbly

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8422
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2018, 07:08:38 PM »
I think you should be promoted to "Captain of the CZ Forum for Reloading".

You would certainly have my vote.

I couldn't possibly accept such a position...
unless is came with a hat that would make 1SOW envious !   O0
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline painter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5564
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #37 on: May 26, 2018, 09:00:05 PM »
I think you should be promoted to "Captain of the CZ Forum for Reloading".

You would certainly have my vote.

I couldn't possibly accept such a position...
unless is came with a hat that would make 1SOW envious !   O0
How about a shot up chrono? :-* ;D
I had the right to remain silent...

but not the ability.

Offline 1SOW

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14840
  • GO GREEN - Recycle 9MM
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #38 on: May 27, 2018, 01:24:46 AM »
Bite your tongue!!  I have some chrono work to do with the Gallant bulletsTuesday. ;)

Offline IDescribe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3672
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #39 on: May 27, 2018, 11:20:48 AM »
No worries.  There is no way - - I repeat: NO WAY - - that you will shoot your chrono Tuesday.  O0

Offline nettle

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 48
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #40 on: May 27, 2018, 11:26:21 PM »
A lot of good information. To tell the truth I have a small farm and haven't had either the time to shoot or reload since my original post. I am on vacation this week and will be doing some shooting and reloading this week. I am out of ammo so I will have to reload some tomorrow using these good suggestions on COAL and crimp diameter.

Offline Wobbly

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8422
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #41 on: May 28, 2018, 10:31:06 AM »
A lot of good information. To tell the truth I have a small farm....

I am on vacation this week....

WHAT ! I thought living on a farm WAS a vacation ! You know, pet the livestock, then ride around on the tractor, wait for the wife to ring the dinner bell. Stop pulling our leg. We all watch Green Acres all the time, and we never see any "work".



 O0
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline Wobbly

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8422
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #42 on: June 03, 2018, 03:46:06 PM »
Here's an aftermarket seating stem, like the one I was talking about....

http://www.uniquetek.com/product/T1561

Look at the 38 listing and it says 'works on 9mm'.

 ;)
« Last Edit: June 03, 2018, 09:42:21 PM by Wobbly »
In God we trust; On 'starting load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong ?

Offline 1SOW

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14840
  • GO GREEN - Recycle 9MM
Re: 125 gr SWC not plunking
« Reply #43 on: June 03, 2018, 08:46:02 PM »
I DID NOT shoot my chrono last Tuesday.
I WILL NOT shoot my chrono at this Tuesday's load tests.
NEVER point your gun at anything that you don't want to destroy.  Uh oh.


 

anything